Inconsistencies and the Wiki

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Smivs
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Inconsistencies and the Wiki

Post by Smivs » Sun May 29, 2011 4:33 pm

While doing a bit of research today I came across what seems to be an inconsistency and inaccuracy on the Wiki concerning the ECM.
On the ECM page, there is no mention of the history and development of the equipment. The Elite Manual, which is the Canon for all things Elite and Oolite clearly states:-
Anti-missile (ECM) System Specification: Radiant-Magnetic "wipe-out" using ion-saturation theory developed by Bell and Braben on riedquat 359. Electronic Counter Measures Systems use minute charged particles of InterSpac heavy Element dust, releasing their radiant energy and setting up expanding nuclear flux chains.
However on the Hardened Missile page, the claim is made (without any attribution) that the ECM is 'Thargoid-inspired' . There is no mention of Bell and Braben on this page, and the Elite Manual section does not mention Thargoids at all.
The conclusion I have come to is that the Hardened Missile page is probably incorrect, and the ECM page is actually missing some vital information.
I am minded to correct these errors and omissions, but would like to give everyone out there a chance to correct me if I'm wrong, or agree that this minor problem should be put right before I change the Wiki entries.
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Re: Inconsistencies and the Wiki

Post by JensAyton » Sun May 29, 2011 5:27 pm

I don’t care either way, but just for the record there’s no actual contradiction here.

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Re: Inconsistencies and the Wiki

Post by Smivs » Sun May 29, 2011 5:58 pm

Ahruman wrote:I don’t care either way, but just for the record there’s no actual contradiction here.
True, not an actual contradiction, but an inconsistency that I feel should be ironed out. The info should be on the ECM page, not the missile page, and I can't find any reference at all to the Thargoid input, so I don't know where that came from. if it's wrong (which looks to be the case) it shouldn't be there.
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Re: Inconsistencies and the Wiki

Post by CommonSenseOTB » Sun May 29, 2011 6:04 pm

Yeah, put it right, you the man!(no really, sombody has to. Just use the appropriate elite manual and keep things accurate. Bet there are other things to be fixed as well in the wiki.)

Have I mentioned what a good job your doing MaikSmivs? Your a real treasure stumpy! :P

Please forgive my sarcastic humor as I've been up all night and had another eureka hud moment and I can't say anything about it until it has been researched thoroughly and brought to a decent level of quality or dismissed altogether. Could take month(s). I'm a little giddy right now but suffice it to say just about every other type of gauge could will be possible in some fashion but at this stage it is just a (very likely to work)theory. Oh man you guys are gonna freak if I can make even half the stuff I came up with last night work! :lol: I can say no more about this! This is not a hijacking! Carry on!

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Re: Inconsistencies and the Wiki

Post by CheeseRedux » Sun May 29, 2011 6:09 pm

This might just be the Alzheimer's speaking, but I distinctly remember it being mentioned somewhere that the bugs were the first to use ECM and that GalCop if not directly copied it, then at least developed a parallel technology inspired by it. My memory of this is pre-Oolite, which leaves four candidates: C-64 manual; Amiga manual; Frontier manual; Random website prior to 2009.
(Or the aforementioned Alzheimer's.)
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Re: Inconsistencies and the Wiki

Post by Smivs » Sun May 29, 2011 6:13 pm

Thanks for the encouragement. I'll bet you're right about other Wiki issues.....I've probably opened a can of worms here and made a whole lot of work for myself. HoHum!
And as I expect I'm alowed to derail my own thread, keep up the work on those HUDs. They're awesome. I remember when I was a boy my Dad bought a tape redorder that had a 'magic eye' meter - two flourescent green bars that used to meet in the middle at full volume.
Image.
Just a thought......
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Re: Inconsistencies and the Wiki

Post by Smivs » Sun May 29, 2011 6:16 pm

Re Cheesy's post, yes I was under the impression that it was Thargoid inspired/derived, but I probably got that from the Missile page. I certainly can't find any authoritative mention of it (or any mention come to that) in the official Elite/Oolite references.
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Re: Inconsistencies and the Wiki

Post by Cody » Sun May 29, 2011 6:17 pm

I think it states in the original manual that Thargoids invariably have ECM... but that's about all.
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Re: Inconsistencies and the Wiki

Post by DaddyHoggy » Sun May 29, 2011 6:19 pm

Just checked the manual on Ian Bell's site - it says that Thargoids invariably carry an ECM system, but doesn't specify anything that might be construed as Galcop stealing a Thargoid invention.
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Re: Inconsistencies and the Wiki

Post by CheeseRedux » Sun May 29, 2011 6:20 pm

Well, if we for a moment disregard the oft-mentioned Alzheimer's, I definitely did not get the Thargoid-inspired bit from any part of the Wiki. So if my memory is to be trusted, this is not something that first cropped up there.
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Re: Inconsistencies and the Wiki

Post by CheeseRedux » Sun May 29, 2011 6:27 pm

Googled for the Frontier manual, and found this: http://www.lemonamiga.com/games/docs.php?id=679

No mention of Thargoids in the entire document, let alone in relation to ECM.
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Re: Inconsistencies and the Wiki

Post by Smivs » Sun May 29, 2011 6:38 pm

So we're still no wiser as to where the Thargoids come in to this! And anyway we're talking about Elite/Oolite, not Frontier.
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Re: Inconsistencies and the Wiki

Post by CheeseRedux » Sun May 29, 2011 6:44 pm

Smivs wrote:we're talking about Elite/Oolite, not Frontier.
I thought we were trying to find the Thargoid connexion. It strikes me as a bit odd to limit the investigation.
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Re: Inconsistencies and the Wiki

Post by Smivs » Sun May 29, 2011 6:50 pm

I will be fully honest here and state that I didn't check Frontier documentation as I fervently believe it is irrelevant to Elite/Oolite. Frontier is set in one possible future and attempts to make itself backwards-compatible with Elite/Oolite because that would suit the makers and marketing men.
I see no need for Elite/Oolite to try and make itself 'forward-compatible' with Frontier. If something is not in the Elite manual or any official Elite/Oolite documentation, it is heresay, not Canon.
Personally I have never seen, let alone played Frontier, and I know it has many fans and I am not against it in any way, but it is not something I consider relevant to Elite/Oolite. Sorry if this offends anyone.
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Re: Inconsistencies and the Wiki

Post by CheeseRedux » Sun May 29, 2011 6:54 pm

My point was that if we had found the information in the Frontier manual, we would have known where it came from.

Anyway, found it:

THARGOID INVASION SHIPS
Though most of the Thargoid Space Fleet is currently engaged by the Galactic Navy in Intergalactic Space, a few of the smaller battle ships make occasional sorties into Human Space. These ships are extremely fast for their size and invariably have ECM Systems (this was originally a Thargoid invention to counter Navy missiles, subsequently copied by the Navy from captured Thargoid ships). Additionally, most Thargoid battle ships carry a few small remote- controlled ships, each equipped with a single pulse laser. It is rumored that the Galactic Navy are designing their own remote-controlled fighter, and will pay well for Thargoid ones to study.

[my bold]


Source: http://www.iancgbell.clara.net/elite/manual.htm - about 90% down on the page.
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