Re: Realistic Shipyards / Oolite Extended - Little Update

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Hotblack's-stuntship
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Re: Realistic Shipyards / Oolite Extended - Little Update

Post by Hotblack's-stuntship »

Moderator: The first two posts in this thread have been moved from the old Oolite Extended / Realistic Shipyards topic, which is why they appear out of sync. Still, I think they belong here rather than the old thread.

So what are you saying? Can anybody use only RS in their OXPs and credit you?
Lestradae wrote:Hi everyone!

Realistic Shipyards and Oolite Extended have been pulled - I will not provide any download links or give out the old files - and they are not coming back the way they were originally planned, as I have to admit that I did write myself into a corner of unsolvable issues with the last versions of this project.

I do have an idea about how to resurrect what was interesting about the original concept, though.

Perhaps there will be an aaaaaall-of-it oxppack and most of the additional functionalities of Oolite Extended in the perhaps not too-far future now - solved by creating a downloadable, bimonthly-updated AddOns-folder (as a more collaborative effort if this should at all be possible) for people who want as many add-ons as possible without spending a week to get 500 oxps to work together - not merging or altering anything and without tweaking more than nescessary for overall compatibility.

Additional older functions - including the repricing of Realistic Shipyards V1.X for example - I will issue as stand-alone oxps that can be picked-and-mixed and would of course be part of the abovementioned oxp-pack. Which functionalities - have a look at my signature :wink:

Cheers,

L

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Lestradae
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Re: Realistic Shipyards / Oolite Extended - Nov. 2012 Update

Post by Lestradae »

Hotblack's-stuntship, you can use anything I have done any way you want without asking. As can anyone else.

I do not think highly of the "it's mine" mindset in an open source project heavily resting on the goodwill of some big players in game and movie industry (such as Oolite), but there you have it.

That said, you might step on some people's toes if you use their stuff (and my old stuff used a lot of stuff other people made) as some see things differently - and I can't speak for them as a matter of of course. The sensible thing might be to ask. As said, not nescessary with my stuff - it's anything goes with that from my side.

The copyright issue is like this - as said above, Oolite is an open source game etc., a complaint from an oxp author probably would never hold up in any court, UK or otherwise, ever. The sensible thing still is coming to some kind of agreement which everyone involved can live with.

Hope that helps.

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Oolite Extended - November 2012 Update

Post by Lestradae »

Hi everyone!

Realistic Shipyards and Oolite Extended have been pulled - I will not provide any download links or give out the old files - and they are not coming back the way they were originally planned, as I have to admit that I did write myself into a corner of unsolvable issues with the last versions of this project.

I do have an idea about how to resurrect what was interesting about the original concept, though.

Perhaps there will be an aaaaaall-of-it oxppack and most of the additional functionalities of Oolite Extended in the perhaps not too-far future now - solved by creating a downloadable, bimonthly-updated AddOns-folder (as a more collaborative effort if this should at all be possible) for people who want as many add-ons as possible without spending a week to get 500 oxps to work together - not merging or altering anything and without tweaking more than nescessary for overall compatibility.

Additional older functions - including the repricing of Realistic Shipyards V1.X for example - I will issue as stand-alone oxps that can be picked-and-mixed and would of course be part of the abovementioned oxp-pack. Which functionalities - have a look at my signature :wink:

Cheers,

L

Hotblack's-stuntship
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Re: Realistic Shipyards / Oolite Extended - Little Update

Post by Hotblack's-stuntship »

Ok thanks. I'll be waiting for your release of RS when you've removed all of the code that steps on toes! :shock:

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Re: Realistic Shipyards / Oolite Extended - Little Update

Post by Lestradae »

Do as you wish - just let me clarify that the stepping on toes was not the big problem. The big problem was that my original concept was technically, inherently flawed and unwieldy. Let's leave it at that.

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Re: Realistic Shipyards / Oolite Extended - Little Update

Post by Hotblack's-stuntship »

Ahhh. Now that I've had time to brainstorm I understand what happened to you.

What needs to be done is to create something like "ripoff_detector.oxp". It would hang around the ship buy screen and tell you how much it thinks you're being ripped off by (or bargain priced for) by using a calculator similar to your equations. Then all you would do is keep adding OXPs with ships until you found one that isn't such a ripoff based on the ship's stats and human judgement. Still not a perfect solution but close.

I don't know if this could be done with the current engine.

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Re: Realistic Shipyards / Oolite Extended - Little Update

Post by nijineko »

i'll be interested in any future work you come up with.
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Re: Realistic Shipyards / Oolite Extended - Little Update

Post by Lestradae »

Whoever is interested into privately testing the OE V2.0 idea, feel free to drop me a PM.

Regards

L

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Re: Realistic Shipyards / Oolite Extended - Little Update

Post by laxori666 »

Is there any updates on the realistic shipyards project? I really liked the idea of sane pricing for ships when I read about it, but it was too sad to see it had been pulled. I like the Oolite Extended idea though I'm still quite new to the game so would probably not make a good tester.

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Re: Realistic Shipyards / Oolite Extended - Little Update

Post by Commander McLane »

laxori666 wrote:Is there any updates on the realistic shipyards project? I really liked the idea of sane pricing for ships when I read about it, but it was too sad to see it had been pulled.
If you're mostly interested in the sane pricing aspect of RS, you could always change the ship prices in the ship OXPs that you have installed (including the built-in ship set) according to the formula that Lestradae used (or according to a formula of your own devision). You don't even need to meddle with the original OXPs. Creating a shipyard-overrides file suffices.

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Re: Realistic Shipyards / Oolite Extended - Little Update

Post by JazHaz »

No updates, and there won't be. The project got pulled a long time ago.

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Re: Realistic Shipyards / Oolite Extended - Little Update

Post by Lestradae »

I had been thinking of a new version of the Realistic Shipyards pricing oxp as recently as this summer. (Not much more, as my enthusiasm to spend considerable time working on this has waned over the years.)

Problem is, there are so many player ships now and ways to further modify them again via scripts (particularly one of the new "ship diversifier" oxps comes to mind, which adds in versions 1.0 to 10.0 even of existing ships) that it is impossible to provide formulaic prices for them oxp-wise the way I did it back then as far as I can see.

I still think that the option of having ships priced on their specs would be nice to have, but it would have to be done as a switch-on function in the core game I think. Switched off on default, but if you want "realistic" prices switch the flag on.

If enough people have an interest in this, perhaps Cim can be persuaded to put an option like this into the game. Not sure if enough people care.

Regards,

L

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Re: Realistic Shipyards / Oolite Extended - Little Update

Post by Norby »

Lestradae wrote:the new "ship diversifier" oxps comes to mind, which adds in versions 1.0 to 10.0 even of existing ships
You mean ShipVersion OXP where the main difference is in recharge rate: add +1/s to a v6 ship which is count but not as much to make huge change in the cost.

The reason is why not changed the price with the version at least a bit is simple: the player.ship.price is read only in js. I think need too much work to make justified .plist files just for the player can buy a bit later only. If you really want it but without enormous work and can wait then ask for core support to can do it from javascript and not by hand, and in this case OXPs can be updated also.

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Re: Realistic Shipyards / Oolite Extended - Little Update

Post by Lestradae »

Norby wrote:
Lestradae wrote:the new "ship diversifier" oxps comes to mind, which adds in versions 1.0 to 10.0 even of existing ships
You mean ShipVersion OXP where the main difference is in recharge rate: add +1/s to a v6 ship which is count but not as much to make huge change in the cost.

The reason is why not changed the price with the version at least a bit is simple: the player.ship.price is read only in js. I think need too much work to make justified .plist files just for the player can buy a bit later only. If you really want it but without enormous work and can wait then ask for core support to can do it from javascript and not by hand, and in this case OXPs can be updated also.
I see. It's a great oxp, btw, I like very much what it does and how it does it, but it is an example why and how the original method of creating streamlined prices and TL availabilities for player ships is no longer viable (in relation to my current workload for Oolite motivation).

The way to go would now be a core game option imo.

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Re: Realistic Shipyards / Oolite Extended - Little Update

Post by Norby »

Lestradae wrote:I like very much what it does and how it does it, but it is an example why and how the original method of creating streamlined prices and TL availabilities for player ships is no longer viable
Thank you and I think the same. Unfortunately I have no motivation to make price changes due to I am satisfied with the current prices (nor ability to do core changes).

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