[Release] Spicy Hermits

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Anonymissimus
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Re: [WIP] Spicy Hermits

Post by Anonymissimus »

Adding beacons to the ASC for every hermit feels like a bad idea though. The problem is similar to having too many primable equipments. When ambushed at the witchpoint I want to quickly get the beacon for some station e.g. space bar and don't want to press key_next_compass_mode a zillion times for it.
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spara
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Re: [WIP] Spicy Hermits

Post by spara »

I think that making hermits "just another station" by giving them beacons is a bad idea. The fact that they are hidden is a big part of their charm. However, the bad guys know where they are, so there should be a way for the player to acquire that information.

For the pirate hermits, an idea could be that when the bounty on your head is high enough, you get inside the pirate organization and the beacon to the pirate hermits gets activated for you. Would be easy to do. Skull and crossbones beacon symbol would needed :wink: .

When combined with the above baddies beacon, the earlier idea of making them TL14 has some merit, I think. To keep things even remotely sane, I would block most of the equipments though. Just some basic stuff and top notch maintenance.

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Re: [WIP] Spicy Hermits

Post by Cody »

spara wrote:However, the bad guys know where they are, so there should be a way for the player to acquire that information.
That should apply to all types of hermit.
spara wrote:To keep things even remotely sane, I would block most of the equipments though. Just some basic stuff and top notch maintenance.
<nods> I was thinking exactly that last night whilst perusing the Wiki equipment list.

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Re: [WIP] Spicy Hermits

Post by spara »

A new version (0.2)

Something to help the player to find hermits: A destination prober.

* Put your weapons on hold and target ship.
* Probing commences and if the target has a station set as it's destination, it's revealed. Otherwise the probing fails.
* If the revealed destination does not have a beacon, a beacon is added.

Most ships are not really going to any station so probing usually fails. It seems to work best on lone ships that seem to be going somewhere. This version does not save beacons and I have not looked at upping the TL with thought yet.

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Re: [WIP] Spicy Hermits

Post by Cody »

spara wrote:It seems to work best on lone ships that seem to be going somewhere.
Like Adders that launch from the main station (or arrive at the witchpoint), and head for other in-system stations/hermits?


As a pilot, I'd not be too happy about my destination being probed. In fact, I'd regard it as hostile behaviour, and take action!

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Re: [WIP] Spicy Hermits

Post by Fritz »

You can do something similar with my torus synchronisation OXP. You can see by the distance to the next waypoint if the ship has a real target or is just lurking or flying an evasive pattern. If the target is several hundred km away and is not the planet/station, the witchpoint, or the sun, it must be a rock hermit (if no OXP created targets exist in the system). Actually I've found some rock hermits by following traders (even before I made the OXP), but still never a pirate hermit... :(
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Re: [WIP] Spicy Hermits

Post by spara »

Cody wrote:
spara wrote:As a pilot, I'd not be too happy about my destination being probed. In fact, I'd regard it as hostile behaviour, and take action!
NPC are probably doing it to you, so now you're even :wink: .

At this point I just want to increase the odds for finding a hermit a bit. Following an odd ship flying to a strange direction is fun for the first time, but gets tedious pretty soon.

Currently I have three options to consider:
1. Just follow odd ships, follow them and if you're lucky and they really are going somewhere, acquire beacon after docking.
2. Probe ships, find their destinations, follow the ships and acquire beacon after docking.
3. Probe ships and acquire beacons. The current implementation.

I think that options 1 and 2 are interesting at first, but over time too tedious, so I settled with option 3. Needs more work and some handwavium, but I think it's the best option. Instead of probing, something less hostile, like enquiring might be used. I'm open to suggestions here :mrgreen: .
I'm planning on saving the beacons over saves per system. Hermits move around once per month or something though, so the saved beacons deprecate over time and you have to find the hermits again when that happens.

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Re: [WIP] Spicy Hermits

Post by Anonymissimus »

Cody wrote:As a pilot, I'd not be too happy about my destination being probed. In fact, I'd regard it as hostile behaviour, and take action!
Why exactly ? If it's a ship that can be considered as allied even ? E.g. a trader should be pleased if a hunter is asking for his/her destination...

But please, do not introduce a primable piece of equipment here, it should work without that.
spara wrote:Hermits move around once per month or something though, so the saved beacons deprecate over time and you have to find the hermits again when that happens.
The 2 and 1 hermits on my favourite trade route (Leanin-Xexedi) are still at the same positions (and names!) after certainly more than an ingame month though. They also had been with other commanders. I seem to recall them changing once, so it seems very likely they stay the same a long ingame time.
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Re: [WIP] Spicy Hermits

Post by Fritz »

Randomshipnames OXP has to remember the individual 'given' name for each rock hermit. The code suggest that hermits will remain at their position as long as you stay in the galaxy.
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Re: [WIP] Spicy Hermits

Post by spara »

You're right. A peek to the populator shows that the hermits always use the same locationSeed. I'm pretty sure that at some point it was something like a month and then the hermits moved. Maybe it was some previous version of Oolite.

This makes it easier to collect a network of hermits. :D

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Re: [WIP] Spicy Hermits

Post by spara »

And now that I'm going through the populator rules, pirate hermits can only be found from Feudal and Anarchy systems. Chaotic ones are possible in all systems.

Anonymissimus, I have no intention to make this primable or even buyable. It will most likely be a feature of the ACS that automatically activates itself when a ship is targeted while weapons are off.

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Re: [WIP] Spicy Hermits

Post by Fritz »

And now that I'm going through the populator rules, pirate hermits can only be found from Feudal and Anarchy systems.
That's interesting. So searching in my current multi-government system is obviously pointless...

Perhaps I'm missing something, but I still think, finding a pirate rock hermit with any of your 3 options will be near to impossible.

Pirate hermits seem to be rare compared to normal (mining) hermits. Most ships going to a station of any kind are traders, and they only go to "friendly" stations. It's quite rare for traders going to rock hermits anyhow, how much rarer (if not impossible) must it be if they consider a pirate hermit as friendly?

Offender traders could behave differently, but they are rare. I followed two or three of them to hermits, but in every case it was a normal mining hermit. Real pirates (not every offender is a pirate!) would of course prefer to go to pirate hermits. But pirates rarely seem to go anywhere, most of them lurk around or attack. Do fleeing ships go anywhere? I doubt it because they tend to show up again. Perhaps I should leave a pirate Python alive and follow it...
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Re: [WIP] Spicy Hermits

Post by Cody »

Fritz wrote:Perhaps I should leave a pirate Python alive and follow it...
Fill its hold with cargo first, then follow it.

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Re: [WIP] Spicy Hermits

Post by spara »

What Cody says.

Pirates use four types of AIs and all head to a station a bit differently:

oolite-pirateAI: enough loot -> go to a station or planet
oolite-pirateFighterAI: no leader -> go to a station or planet
oolite-pirateFreighterAI: enough loot and home system -> go to a station or planet
oolite-pirateInterceptorAI: patrol over and home system -> go to a station or planet

So it's possible to follow a suitable one to it's base. Probing might make this a bit easier. Or not.

This need a bit thought obviously.

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Re: [WIP] Spicy Hermits

Post by Fritz »

I think my problem is that I usually destroy them... :roll:
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